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terranceandphillip2 11:55 Mon Nov 21
Bilic has given the team no personality or character

I like Slav, but over a year on as manager what's the 'character' of our team. Klopp has imposed a system and a character on his Liverpool team with great results. We have none and for the most look like a collection of individuals trying to find a system. I wouldn't bet on half of our first team putting up a fight when it comes to the crunch.

Lee Trundle 9:16 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

"he deserves support rather than calls for him to go at the first sign of trouble"

I'd agree with the support bit, but Sunday wasn't the first sign of trouble this season.

We were pretty dire preseason.
We were then pretty dire going out in the Europa Cup early doors.
We were pretty dire in the League Cup game against Accrington Stanley.
We're now pretty dire in the league.

Anyone who isn't worried about the form we've been in all season should wake up a bit. Slav needs to turn it around and fast, but he couldn't have chosen a harder run to do it with the games we've got coming up.

Sir Alf 9:02 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

After a couple of days, and trying to be objective and less emotional (but it still hurts), Bilic's use of Nordtveit was definitely a problem. Zaza not so much IMO . He didn't make us any worse or at least not that I could see. Like Sakho he struggled to hold the ball up but was getting to headers as indeed Sakho was. The service to both strikers was poor and more suited to Carroll (maybe a hangover from the Allardyce era? )The only criticism of him was his snatching at the one half decent chance he did get.

Nordtveid was a different story and always a risk. Collins was the obvious choice unless his minor injury as still considered a problem? I understood the thinking to put another defensive player on but removing Payet was removing an outlet and a player that Spurs had to keep an eye on as he has the potential to unlock them with his passing. The second problem was that Nordtveid had hardly played so was always going to be less than match sharp and perhaps trying too hard to get involved which might explain him going to ground and giving Son the chance to wait for the contact. Bilic got that wrong and we paid dearly for it.

In hindsight, changing goalkeepers also caused an issue. Randolph hardly had a shot but he made a positive move for that cross on the second goal that if he had left it would likely have either gone across the goal and out or to Ogbonna to clear. His positioning was poor and he simply misjudged it.

But the root cause as a team IMHO remains our inability to retain possession and especially in midfield and this season as more and more teams are playing the "high press" game and closing down quicker. We are struggling as we either are not fit enough and / or still lacking the pace and movement. We rightly moved Kouyate out of midfield but have no one to replace him or Bilic does not believe Fernandes is ready to start every game yet. Ayew was out a long while and is taking time to get back up to speed so we have yet to see our best fully fit team.

Noble will be back no doubt and we will again suffer by being closed down too easily or lacking the movement and pace to stretch teams. This all leads back to not being able to keep possession, and falling back to the Allardyce "boot it out" policy and straight back to the opposition. Teams like Tottenham who have quality and depth (best part of 10 years investment in the squad) will eventually find a way through you if you keep giving them the bleedin ball.

ANd of course you cannot ignore the poor investment over the Summer. We have not improved enough and did not buy players who are of the technical quality and with the strength and movemet to help us keep the ball. Our owners did not invest enough and what they did invest was aimed at quantity not quality. We need budgets of 70 million + not 30 - 50 million until we can get players with a resale value. Our owners have to understand that. You cannot be looking for value all the time and have to pay over the odds sometimes (as we ended up doing with Ayew in the last chance saloon in the Summer).

Bilic is to blame in part but the owners (Sullivan) takes a big proportion of the blame if as we suspect his ego and need to prove he can get a good "deal" led to us missing out on some better alternatives?

I must say though, I did see some positives and we have improved in many aspects. Hopefully Sakho and Ayew getting fully fit will make us more effective going forward and lets hope Zaza, Tore, Nordtveit, Ferghouli do not get near the first team again.

I fvcking hate Tottenham and what makes it worse is that I am at the same time jealous of what they have built over there. It pains me to say it. They are looking upwards as we once again look over our shoulders. Typical West Ham.

62Hammer 9:00 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

The trouble is that after last season we should have been able to use that as a starting point and push on, but that's been made almost impossible by the move from the Boleyn. Upton Park was our heart and our home, and we just don't have that now, somewhere we can get back to during a bad run and dig out a result or two.
A load of bad signings are to blame too, admittedly, or another dreadful set of injuries. But I've just been watching the last home game of last season, the atmosphere and the emotion, and Bilic's tears at the end, and I think that after what he gave us last season he deserves support rather than calls for him to go at the first sign of trouble. He's an intelligent man, I'd like to see him given every chance to put things right.
This is West Ham, for Christ sake, and it's been like this, up one minute and down the next, as long as I remember, going back to the early 60s, and I've never really minded, on the whole.

The Joker 8:34 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

As has been well covered elsewhere, ultimately our shit summer window sees us in this mess. A surfeit of right sided midfield / forwards, no right back and no striker worthy of the name - absolutely atrocious. Chuck in some injuries on top and Slaven has had his hands tied due to the poor squad that he and or the Dildos built. He has no quality options to change things and is picking teams on the hoof. Hence we look disjointed, incoherent and lacking a pattern.

If we had a fit decent striker we would be a completely different animal. Unfortunately despite the large talk in the summer from Sullivan we signed an unneeded non-striker for £20m, a young prospect, the standard South American punt and a sack of shite Italian in one of the most one sided loan deals in history - a deal that completely works against the manager' and should have never been agreed.

wrighty 8:21 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

The fact is we consistently concede goals and don't score many. If that continues into February we will struggle to stay up.

The Joker 8:19 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

No cunt said this last season.

Hammer and Pickle 8:17 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

Agreed - don't see the plan or the work from Bilić coming through on the pitch and I'm beginning to accept that's because there is no plan and no work.

Whether or not the owners' lack of planning or work has anything to do with it is another matter. Fact is, I have never seen such an abject surrender from a West Ham team at WHL when 10 minutes from a win and I am still livid.

Lertie Button 8:05 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

Just the winning personality and character would do for me, honestly still can't believe how shit we have been and desperately hope he can sort things out

Lee Trundle 7:33 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

It's like he's a completely different manager compared to last season.

Last season, I remember many times where we'd be in a winning position and he'd bring on a striker to replace a midfielder, which would keep us on the front foot, and keep the pressure on the other team. Those substitutions cost us the game against Spurs.

i-Ron 7:13 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

I'm still fucking gutted as you can tell. Gifting the yids 3 points like that.

i-Ron 7:11 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

I don't like the football this season. Especially this current shape I just don't 'get it'.

It's utterly toothless up front. We'be transformed into a team relying on set piece and relying on headers ... exactly the main ingredients everyone fucking HATED about Fat Sam for.... and with abysmal defensive errors instead.

No strikers have scored, our top scorer hasn't even scored with his feet yet, and he's played right back and mainly wing back....

Sven Roeder 6:54 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

Being top of your Champions league group will do that.
I imagine most Leicester fans see last season as a one off dream and although they want to be doing better in the league just want to enjoy this once in a lifetime Champions league run.

Face 6:52 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

Leicester are current Champions and are about to qualify for the last 16 of the CL, as opposed to us not having any real positives at all this season.

Alfs 6:49 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

I've just had a quick look on the Leicester site (1pt above us) to see if there's a load of knicker wetting and calls for Ranieri's sacking. Absolutely none at all. Instead they remain supportive.

dicksie3 6:24 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

Some people are getting very defensive over the manager.

I still back him, for now, but aren't supporters allowed to have their doubts?!

Our form over the last 15-20 league games - practically half a season - is simply not good enough. It's relegation standard.

tnb 6:19 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

We have an identity when things are going well. But that's not enough. Good managers maintain or change that identity when times are hard. What we saw on Saturday is that he even seems to have lost his bottle/ self belief when we ARE winning. That Nortveidt sub was no better than Allardyce bringing on Jenkinson at right wing in front of O'Brien up at Everton in the FA cup.

I like Slav as a person, as little as I can claim to know him, and I want him to make it work. But I am now ready to admit that I am fucking worried.

stewie griffin 6:16 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

Well, this is spectacularly ridiculous

Personality & Character? Last season we won 18 (EIGHTEEN) points from losing positions. The 2nd (SECOND) most in the League.

We had personality and character in abundance.

Let's play a game. See if anyone can figure out what - apart from the team - had personality and character last season, and this season has precisely ZERO personality and character?

Russ of the BML 6:01 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

Lily Hammer 4:55 Mon Nov 21

The players. Bilic picked them and put them out there and they did the rest. Credit to him for fielding a side that could get to within minutes of doing that. But the players got us there.

Then the instant Bilic gets involved it goes tits up. Little bit like changing air-plane wheels to pram wheels just as you come into land. Always going to end up messy.

HairyHammer 5:12 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

Lily

Of course the players have to take some blame too but to change the shape slightly and bring on two pretty average ability players who have average brains was a Bilic move.

w4hammer 5:10 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

Lily Hammer 4:55 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character
If the final collapse in the final few minutes was down to Bilic, then who was responsible for us leading 2-1 away to unbeaten tottenham with minutes to go?

-
_______

its called game managment- which is 90% down to the manager and 10% to the squad who are on the pitch at the time. Game management is about the first second to the last.

Lily Hammer 4:55 Mon Nov 21
Re: Bilic has given the team no personality or character

If the final collapse in the final few minutes was down to Bilic, then who was responsible for us leading 2-1 away to unbeaten tottenham with minutes to go?

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